Comments on: Encouraging (Some) Media to Speak Out http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/ Informed comment and commentary about Saudi Arabia, reform, and its relations with the US Wed, 23 May 2012 23:26:18 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17464 John Burgess Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:27:09 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17464 Aafke has it right. While there's no piece of paper telling journalists to not write on the subject, apparently word got out that the papers should let this particular issue cool for a while. During that time, however, there were several news pieces about Saudi women's triumphs and tragedies behind the wheel, just no op-eds calling for it or columns discussing it. Newspapers in neighboring states, however, had a sudden flourishing of those columns! Aafke has it right. While there’s no piece of paper telling journalists to not write on the subject, apparently word got out that the papers should let this particular issue cool for a while. During that time, however, there were several news pieces about Saudi women’s triumphs and tragedies behind the wheel, just no op-eds calling for it or columns discussing it.

Newspapers in neighboring states, however, had a sudden flourishing of those columns!

]]> By: Aafke http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17459 Aafke Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:27:19 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17459 Yes, apparently journalists are not to put in articles on women driving. There was a link a while back, on Saudi Jeans to an article which a paper refused to publish, and which was published on the internet instead. Yes, apparently journalists are not to put in articles on women driving. There was a link a while back, on Saudi Jeans to an article which a paper refused to publish, and which was published on the internet instead.

]]> By: Heidi http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17455 Heidi Mon, 15 Dec 2008 06:59:09 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17455 Was there a moratorium on articles about women driving? WhY and when? Is that an official thing or self censorship again? Does anyone know what's happening with this whole issue? Was there a moratorium on articles about women driving? WhY and when? Is that an official thing or self censorship again?
Does anyone know what’s happening with this whole issue?

]]> By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17434 John Burgess Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:17:56 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17434 Well, I haven't seen any articles on it of late... Maybe women are already driving and they just forgot to report it? Well, I haven’t seen any articles on it of late…

Maybe women are already driving and they just forgot to report it?

]]> By: Aafke http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17431 Aafke Sun, 14 Dec 2008 20:52:36 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17431 John is all for freedom of speach! :) What about the moratorium on articles about ''women driving''? Is that lifted now in this all out festival of free-journalism? John is all for freedom of speach! :)

What about the moratorium on articles about ”women driving”? Is that lifted now in this all out festival of free-journalism?

]]> By: Sparky http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17430 Sparky Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:14:57 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17430 "Forum on freedom of press gets off to censored start" Let me humbly quote Thomas Jefferson "I have sworn upon the alter of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man" - Thomas Jefferson "Of all the forms of tyranny over the mind of man, none is more terrible than fear -- to be afraid of being one's self among one's neighbors." -Paul B. Hoffman And as long as John will tolerate it on his blog :-) Thank you John for letting me express myself... “Forum on freedom of press gets off to censored start”

Let me humbly quote Thomas Jefferson

“I have sworn upon the alter of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man”

- Thomas Jefferson

“Of all the forms of tyranny
over the mind of man,
none is more terrible than fear –
to be afraid
of being one’s self
among one’s neighbors.”

-Paul B. Hoffman

And as long as John will tolerate it on his blog :-) Thank you John for letting me express myself…

]]> By: Sparky http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17427 Sparky Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:12:46 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17427 I give the Saudis much props and credit to a seamless Hajj but I disagree or would object to that necessarily being primarily motivated by pious and righteousness inclinations. But only God knows the intentions of individuals at the end of the day... There is just so much more issues that need progress that are moving at snail speed that OUTRAGE ME! I give the Saudis much props and credit to a seamless Hajj but I disagree or would object to that necessarily being primarily motivated by pious and righteousness inclinations. But only God knows the intentions of individuals at the end of the day…

There is just so much more issues that need progress that are moving at snail speed that OUTRAGE ME!

]]> By: Sparky http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17426 Sparky Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:08:57 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17426 Let me clarify what I mean in the above post timed 11:28 because it may be subject to various intrepretations: Here goes: What I mean is that it is all talk (aka. black propaganda)that is all I ever see and no action (aka. in terms of progress of women's rights for example which is an important and relevant subject to me). Because I see no progress in regards to actions in regards to human rights especially those regarding women they are only empty words and promises (aka. in terms of talking about how great Islam is which I do not argue but I argue against ideology versus current practice). Thus by showing the true image of Islam in coerced words does nothing or carries no meaning to me personally and serves as but a meaningless form of expression (aka. toilet paper) absent of actions. Let me clarify what I mean in the above post timed 11:28 because it may be subject to various intrepretations: Here goes:

What I mean is that it is all talk (aka. black propaganda)that is all I ever see and no action (aka. in terms of progress of women’s rights for example which is an important and relevant subject to me).

Because I see no progress in regards to actions in regards to human rights especially those regarding women they are only empty words and promises (aka. in terms of talking about how great Islam is which I do not argue but I argue against ideology versus current practice).

Thus by showing the true image of Islam in coerced words does nothing or carries no meaning to me personally and serves as but a meaningless form of expression (aka. toilet paper) absent of actions.

]]> By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17422 John Burgess Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:34:52 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17422 Yes, a seamless Haj is to be expected. But it is not something that happens automatically. With 3.5 million people coming to one place, at one time, to do exactly the same things--and to have them do it without chaos and catastrophe--is worth a certain amount of self-congratulation. Supporting the Haj takes time, money, and interest, so I think a certain amount of praise is due. I think any major US city would have trouble coping with what is, in essence, 60 Super Bowls going on at the same time, for five days straight. I don't see anything wrong with projecting an ideal while knowing full well that the reality falls short of that ideal. I don't find that hypocritical at all. And Haj is perhaps the time the Saudis--at least those in Mecca--demonstrate and act upon religious tolerance. Sufis and Shi'ites are welcome to Haj and do the rituals in their own way. Things get a little sketchier post-Haj, in Medina, but that <em>is</em> post-Haj. Yes, a seamless Haj is to be expected. But it is not something that happens automatically. With 3.5 million people coming to one place, at one time, to do exactly the same things–and to have them do it without chaos and catastrophe–is worth a certain amount of self-congratulation. Supporting the Haj takes time, money, and interest, so I think a certain amount of praise is due.

I think any major US city would have trouble coping with what is, in essence, 60 Super Bowls going on at the same time, for five days straight.

I don’t see anything wrong with projecting an ideal while knowing full well that the reality falls short of that ideal. I don’t find that hypocritical at all. And Haj is perhaps the time the Saudis–at least those in Mecca–demonstrate and act upon religious tolerance. Sufis and Shi’ites are welcome to Haj and do the rituals in their own way. Things get a little sketchier post-Haj, in Medina, but that is post-Haj.

]]> By: Andrew http://xrdarabia.org/2008/12/13/encouraging-some-media-to-speak-out/comment-page-1/#comment-17419 Andrew Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:19:18 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/?p=6248#comment-17419 The King's vision for society is noble. The challenge is that the ulemaa will never agree to it. For example, while it is fine to say that Muslims should speak about the real face of Islam, that is contradicted by the fact that only one very narrow version of Islam (that of the ulemaa) is permitted. What would happen were a journalist to publish articles on the traditions, philosophy, and ideas of the Sufi, Shi'a, or Ahmadiyya community? The answer is clear -- the articles would be proscribed by the ulemaa. So, while it is right to say that religious perspectives should be freely available regarding Islam, it should include all the paths chosen by those who believe that they follow religion, and certainly all paths chosen by those who believe that they follow the ways of the Rasulullah. That must include those whom we commonly deride as apostates or non-believers. There should be no compulsion in matters of religion, the Quran states. It is regrettable that this precept is always forgotten by the ulemaa. The King’s vision for society is noble.

The challenge is that the ulemaa will never agree to it.

For example, while it is fine to say that Muslims should speak about the real face of Islam, that is contradicted by the fact that only one very narrow version of Islam (that of the ulemaa) is permitted.

What would happen were a journalist to publish articles on the traditions, philosophy, and ideas of the Sufi, Shi’a, or Ahmadiyya community?

The answer is clear — the articles would be proscribed by the ulemaa.

So, while it is right to say that religious perspectives should be freely available regarding Islam, it should include all the paths chosen by those who believe that they follow religion, and certainly all paths chosen by those who believe that they follow the ways of the Rasulullah.

That must include those whom we commonly deride as apostates or non-believers.

There should be no compulsion in matters of religion, the Quran states.

It is regrettable that this precept is always forgotten by the ulemaa.

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