Comments on: Saudi Women Gain Permission to Drive http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/ Informed comment and commentary about Saudi Arabia, reform, and its relations with the US Mon, 13 Feb 2012 09:58:33 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Shoura Council to Permit Saudi Women’s Driving? - Mideast Youth - Thinking Ahead http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-12357 Shoura Council to Permit Saudi Women’s Driving? - Mideast Youth - Thinking Ahead Fri, 21 Mar 2008 23:08:18 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-12357 [...] story, along with the January report in the British paper The Telegraph, suggest that something is happening on the [...] [...] story, along with the January report in the British paper The Telegraph, suggest that something is happening on the [...]

]]> By: Blog : A Distant Soil http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-11801 Blog : A Distant Soil Fri, 22 Feb 2008 21:25:58 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-11801 [...] Arabian women to get right to drive cars. Hat tip: [...] [...] Arabian women to get right to drive cars. Hat tip: [...]

]]> By: Miriam Mac http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10862 Miriam Mac Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:30:30 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10862 Expat and Saudi women go out alone all the time here in Jeddah. I mean, they may need a driver to get somewhere, but then you can see them walking alone in malls, supermarkets, etc. By the way, expats, in general, are viewed as loose women here, even when fully covered. Just comes with the territory. Expat and Saudi women go out alone all the time here in Jeddah. I mean, they may need a driver to get somewhere, but then you can see them walking alone in malls, supermarkets, etc. By the way, expats, in general, are viewed as loose women here, even when fully covered. Just comes with the territory.

]]> By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10860 John Burgess Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:02:31 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10860 Not at all a bad joke! Just not enough caffeine in my system to get it... Not at all a bad joke! Just not enough caffeine in my system to get it…

]]> By: Saudi in US http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10859 Saudi in US Wed, 30 Jan 2008 15:55:41 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10859 Typo on my part. "Limbo" the dance where you lower the bar and try to get under it without touching the floor vs "Lipmo". It seems the way some of the sharia laws get interpreted sounds like a circus act. Bad joke on my part :) Typo on my part. “Limbo” the dance where you lower the bar and try to get under it without touching the floor vs “Lipmo”. It seems the way some of the sharia laws get interpreted sounds like a circus act. Bad joke on my part :)

]]> By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10855 John Burgess Wed, 30 Jan 2008 14:48:10 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10855 I can <em>say</em> Limpo, but I don't know what it means? Expand, please... I can say Limpo, but I don’t know what it means?

Expand, please…

]]> By: Saudi in US http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10852 Saudi in US Wed, 30 Jan 2008 07:11:10 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10852 I always held the opinion that you can find away to justify many things with the right interpretation and changing a few variables to fit a text definition. This includes outrageous ones. For example some scholars will justify marriage of Mut3ah, which is a marriage with intent to divorce after a short period of time. That can be only 1 day. Which is equivalent to legal adultery. The other example is justifying paying interest by restructuring loans under Islamic banking system. We just call it something different and make it work under religious context. So positive things like insurance can be justified with few twists if there is a well. Can you say Limpo... I always held the opinion that you can find away to justify many things with the right interpretation and changing a few variables to fit a text definition. This includes outrageous ones. For example some scholars will justify marriage of Mut3ah, which is a marriage with intent to divorce after a short period of time. That can be only 1 day. Which is equivalent to legal adultery.

The other example is justifying paying interest by restructuring loans under Islamic banking system. We just call it something different and make it work under religious context.

So positive things like insurance can be justified with few twists if there is a well. Can you say Limpo…

]]> By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10850 John Burgess Wed, 30 Jan 2008 05:10:13 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10850 Just to get it in the record, <em>Arab News</em>' 'Islam' page on Jan. 30, 2008, ran a question/answer on insurance and whether it was Islamically proper: <blockquote>Q.2. Is investing money in the form of a life insurance acceptable, particularly if it reduces our income tax liability? Is it permissible to subscribe to health insurance or educational insurance? A.2. Scholarly views on insurance differ. However, I find the view that insurance is permissible to be perfectly valid. It is supported by sound evidence. Moreover, it gives the insured good returns for the money invested, not least the peace of mind that is associated with the alleviation of risk. This applies to life insurance and health insurance. I am not clear what educational insurance means. If it means that a person takes an insurance policy to pay for the education of one’s children, then this is a form of saving for a particular purpose. There is no loss involved for anyone. Therefore, it is permissible, unless the money is invested in a usurious transaction, in which case it becomes unacceptable because of this investment.</blockquote> Just to get it in the record, Arab News‘ ‘Islam’ page on Jan. 30, 2008, ran a question/answer on insurance and whether it was Islamically proper:

Q.2. Is investing money in the form of a life insurance acceptable, particularly if it reduces our income tax liability? Is it permissible to subscribe to health insurance or educational insurance?

A.2. Scholarly views on insurance differ. However, I find the view that insurance is permissible to be perfectly valid. It is supported by sound evidence. Moreover, it gives the insured good returns for the money invested, not least the peace of mind that is associated with the alleviation of risk. This applies to life insurance and health insurance. I am not clear what educational insurance means. If it means that a person takes an insurance policy to pay for the education of one’s children, then this is a form of saving for a particular purpose. There is no loss involved for anyone. Therefore, it is permissible, unless the money is invested in a usurious transaction, in which case it becomes unacceptable because of this investment.

]]> By: Sparky http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10817 Sparky Mon, 28 Jan 2008 08:00:55 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10817 K. Ternes the media likes to report that a woman cannot go out without a male escort that is false if not a blatant lie. Islamically she is supposed to have her husband's permission or no objection in order to go out. If her male relative is normal then she has no problems and most likely comes and goes as she likes. The male escort is a requirement only if she is going to travel a certain (Long) distance. However, this rule can be broken, and it is not considered a major sin either. K. Ternes the media likes to report that a woman cannot go out without a male escort that is false if not a blatant lie.

Islamically she is supposed to have her husband’s permission or no objection in order to go out. If her male relative is normal then she has no problems and most likely comes and goes as she likes. The male escort is a requirement only if she is going to travel a certain (Long) distance. However, this rule can be broken, and it is not considered a major sin either.

]]> By: John Burgess http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/comment-page-1/#comment-10812 John Burgess Mon, 28 Jan 2008 02:41:32 +0000 http://xrdarabia.org/2008/01/21/saudi-women-gain-permission-to-drive/#comment-10812 In remaking Saudi society, there are many, interlocking elements that needs to be changed. What changes first will have an effect on what follows, of course. The fact is that Saudi women are not prohibited by women, but by culture, from going out alone. There is not 'real' argument against their driving. What is preferable, for cultural reasons, may not be attainable because of reality. Saudi conservatives fear that women, left to their own devices, will create mischief and create discord in families. That idea is both demeaning and retrogressive. Women, as much as men, can be and are equally responsible for their conduct. In remaking Saudi society, there are many, interlocking elements that needs to be changed. What changes first will have an effect on what follows, of course.

The fact is that Saudi women are not prohibited by women, but by culture, from going out alone. There is not ‘real’ argument against their driving. What is preferable, for cultural reasons, may not be attainable because of reality.

Saudi conservatives fear that women, left to their own devices, will create mischief and create discord in families. That idea is both demeaning and retrogressive. Women, as much as men, can be and are equally responsible for their conduct.

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